Finding Robert

The Question

I sometimes get the question: How did you find out you were descended from Robert the Bruce? So, I'll answer it here. I'll share the process I took to discover that Robert the Bruce is my ancestor. Initially, I didn't set out to find he was my ancestor. When I began my genealogical quest in 1986, I didn't even know about Robert the Bruce. Yet, in my quest, I would eventually find over the decades that I am indeed descended from Robert the Bruce.

What I inherited and knew

By 1986, a lot of the genealogical research for my family back 8 generations had been completed by my late Aunt Jerrie and others. Jerrie would pass documents on to my father. There were 2 documents in particular. One was a 1973 document entitled Johnson History, sent to my aunt from her uncle Allen Starling Johnson, Sr. It mentioned my great-great-great-great grandparents James "Jimmy" Johnson and Nancy Charity (Skeen) Johnson. Jerrie also sent a document she compiled about the ancestry of Norman Harris Johnson and Julia Pricilla (Morris) Johnson, which also mentioned Jimmy and N. Charity (Skeen) Johnson. For years, my parents had on their shelf a book FARMER Yesterday and Today (researched and compiled by Leah Hammond and Charles Lester Cranford; edited by Zeb R. Denny; published by Wooten Printing Co., Inc. Welcome, NC, 1981). On p. 116, it mentions Jimmy and Charity (Skeen) Johnson. And for years, that's all I knew of N. Charity (Skeen) Johnson.

Hiatus and renewed interest

I would take somewhat of a hiatus from actively researching genealogy during my high school, college and graduate school years. I would still look and read documents and explore, but I had gotten it as far back as I could with the resources of that time. Eventually, I had my trusty modem and Internet access. And my 2nd cousin Beth Johnson was doing quite a bit of research and updating me regularly with emails of findings. I would leverage the Internet on my quest for my ancestors though I found nothing regarding Nancy Charity (Skeen) Johnson (nor was I particularly focused on that at the time). She was one of those endpoints. And it would remain that way for years.

By 2014, I had gotten into the DNA side of genealogy. And by 2015, I had found online sources and documents and traced back considerably to potential royal ancestry. Some of it was in error (which I later removed/corrected with further research), but my quest pushed forward all the more.

Skeen - the connection

You've noticed I've often referred to my great-great-great-great grandmother Nancy Charity (Skeen) Johnson throughout this document. She is my gateway ancestor to Robert the Bruce. Initially, I did not know that. I already had the documents mentioning her as my ancestor and I am the great grandson of her great grandson Norman Harris Johnson. And I have pictures of Norman. My late father shared memories of his grandfather Norman and even took me to his house. Dad knew Norman and Norman was 38 years old when his grandfather Allen Harris Johnson died. And Allen Harris Johnson was the son of Nancy Charity (Skeen) Johnson. Why all the detail? Well, first, it's how I write. Second, people knew people and those connections are significant. Aunt Jerrie knew her grandfather Norman. That's how the documentation came to her and to my father and to me. And while there are erroneous documents on the Internet, there are a lot of good sources. I have found sources there and elsewehere. Deed Abstracts (found in the home of Carl G. Nance, who died Oct. 11, 1980) include a sale September 4, 1872, where my great-great-great grandfather Allen Harris Johnson sold to his brother O.P. Johnson and wife Clarinda Coggin Johnson for $550 land of 135 acres (Source: FARMER Yesterday and Today, p. 18). They are sons of Nancy Charity (Skeen) Johnson. I found the death certificate for that O.P. Johnson, which mentions his mother's maiden name Nancy Skeen. And there is a document regarding the land of my late ancestor John Johnson being granted to my ancestor James Johnson (husband of Nancy Skeen) and among the signatures on the document is that of Osborn Skeen, brother of my great-great-great-great grandmother Nancy Charity (Skeen) Johnson. And even the geography with the road names where my ancestors lived show this Skeen ancestry. Like those before me, I pressed on in my quest, focusing on the surname Skeen.

By June 2016, I had uncovered the first version of my Skeen ancestry and by August 2017 I had cleaned up and verified that ancestry with further research. Sources I used are listed at the top of my Skeen ancestry page. Further researching the Skeens led me to find that my Skeen ancestry was descended from multiple lines of Skene who all descended from the Scottish Clan Skene. And that ancestry had a line descended from Robert the Bruce marry into it. I spent 2 to 3 years researching the Skeens/Skenes and Robert the Bruce by perusing various sites and books (listed at the tops of my Skeen ancestry, Skene ancestry and Clan Skene pages). By May 2019, I was able to conclude my descent from Robert the Bruce through his descendant Agnes (Forbes) De Skene. And that opened up researching him and his ancestors, something that continues to this day.

Clans, Royal Lines and sources

Clans and royal lines and their ancestries are well-documented. That includes Robert the Bruce. And that has been an advantage. There are lots of books and online resources (which also includes books) to help for the older genealogies. Granted, they have to be used judiciously as there are some mistakes and speculations, but also plenty of legitimate research. So, things need to be verified. I tend to use multiple sources for that reason. Geni.com has Master Profiles that are sourced by curators who are genealogical researchers. And believe it or not, some WikiPedia pages for historical figures are well-sourced. Again, use those judiciously. That is true of any of the genealogy sites such as FamilySearch.com, Ancestry.com, WikiTree.com, etc., but I glean from them all. I look for well-sourced pages. I have sources listed at the tops of my Skeen ancestry, Skene ancestry and Clan Skene pages, and for Robert the Bruce, I used sources, which I listed at my royal Scottish ancestry page. I continue this process in my current research, some of which includes the ancestry of Robert the Bruce, which itself has involved research of lines back to Charlemagne, Alfred the Great, Rollo the Viking and William the Conqueror.

DNA

So, I had the 2 documents (and the aforementioned land grant, a death certficate, geography and books and other sources) for Nancy Charity (Skeen) Johnson and discovered resources for Robert the Bruce. Researching those 2 individuals didn't seem to take as much work as the research connecting the two. DNA ended up being similar -- having bookends, so to speak. It has played a role, but a minor one. DNA can be helpful, with some caveats. AncestryDNA, 23andMe, FamilyTreeDNA, MyHeritage, Geni.com, WikiTree, GEDmatch, Geneanet and MyTrueAncestry are all helpful in my DNA research, which I've been doing since 2014. However, with DNA, folks like Robert the Bruce are too far back for DNA to do much -- unless I was a Bruce or had a matrilineal line back to one of his five daughters (I am descended from his daughter Marjorie Bruce). Most DNA tests test for autosomal DNA, which is a mix of mother and father and good for about 6 to 8 generations, though I've seen it trace back up to 10 generations in some cases. It depends on how God has knitted Mom's and Dad's DNA together. Males have Y-DNA (which can be tested at FamilyTreeDNA.com) which goes back much, much further than autosomal DNA (I think 25 generations) and traces the father's father's father's father's ... father's line, passed from father to son. That would be helpful if a man has the surname Bruce and it is found through Y-DNA that he is descended from Robert the Bruce, such as is the case for a man named Rollo Bruce. I do not have Bruce Y-DNA. I have Johnson/Johnston Y-DNA. So, Y-DNA won't help for finding Robert the Bruce. Robert is 23 to 25 generations back from me, depending on which line I trace. So, autosomal DNA won't help there since that is well beyond the 6 to 8 generations it typically reaches. There is also mitochondrial DNA (which can be tested at FamilyTreeDNA.com) which traces a mother's mother's mother's ... mother's line, passed from mother to children, and I think it goes back 52 generations. So, that can be helpful, but it would be difficult to determine if I get back to one of Robert the Bruce's daughters. And there is X-DNA, which is a bit more complicated. It follows X-chromosomes passed to the child. For males, it goes back to the mother's X-chromosome, which goes to both her parents' X-chromosomes. For females, it goes back to both parents' X-chromosomes. So, it offers a subset of the whole tree, but it goes back greater than 10 generations. Yet, that is not far enough for Robert the Bruce.

So how did DNA play a role in my finding Robert? It didn't directly play a role, but more offered some insight. There is a site called MyTrueAncestry which matches DNA to ancient samples. Through mytrueancestry, my DNA matches Clan Robertson, which is the parent clan of Clan Skene. And in addition to documentation, I have verified DNA connections to Skeen via my 4x great grandmother and her parents and grandparents. DNA-wise, I had references to the beginning and my end of the Skeen/Skene line. As mentioned, it took books and documents to pull it all together and to find that connection back to Robert the Bruce. The further you go back, the more you have to rely on documentation and history than genetics.

And that's how I found Robert.

Finding Robert

I sometimes get the question: How did you find out you were descended from Robert the Bruce? So, I'll answer it here, but in a round-about way so as to aid researchers in general. I'll share the multi-faceted process I took to discover that Robert the Bruce is my ancestor.

Royal Lines

Royal lines and their ancestries are well-documented. That includes Robert the Bruce. There are lots of books and online resources (which also includes books) to help for the older genealogies. Granted, they have to be used judiciously as there are as many mistakes/speculations as there are entries of legitimate research. So, things need to be verified. I tend to use multiple sources for that reason. Geni.com has Master Profiles that are sourced by curators who are genealogical researchers. And believe it or not, some WikiPedia pages for historical figures are well-sourced. Again, use those judiciously. That is true of any of the genealogy sites such as FamilySearch.com, Ancestry.com, WikiTree.com, etc., but I glean from them all. I look for well-sourced pages.

Books

What books should be used in research? It depends on what you are researching. Skene/Skeen is in my ancestry. So, I looked at multiple books for a couple years for Clan Skene in Scotland to make connections. This ancestry led to my gateway ancestor Robert the Bruce. Robert the Bruce is called a "gateway" because he is one of the ancestors with ancestral lines back to Charlemagne, Alfred the Great, Rollo the Viking and William the Conqueror. For Robert the Bruce, I used sources, which I listed at Royal Scottish Ancestry. For more recent times (1700s-1900s), ship manifests, books, immigration records, wills/probates, cemetery and census data. And notable ancestors who are historical figures have more documentation available, but even my common ancestors have quite a bit that I have found over the years online and in libraries.

DNA

DNA can be helpful, with some caveats. AncestryDNA, 23andMe, FamilyTreeDNA, MyHeritage, Geni.com, WikiTree, GEDmatch, Geneanet and MyTrueAncestry are all helpful in my DNA research, which I've been doing since 2014. However, with DNA, folks like Robert the Bruce are too far back for DNA to do much -- unless I was a Bruce or had a matrilineal line back to his daughter. Most DNA tests test for autosomal DNA, which is a mix of mother and father and good for about 6 to 8 generations, though I've seen it trace back up to 10 generations in some cases. It depends on how God has knitted Mom's and Dad's DNA together. Males have Y-DNA (which can be tested at FamilyTreeDNA.com) which goes back much, much further than autosomal DNA (I think 25 generations) and traces the father's father's father's father's ... father's line, passed from father to son. Robert the Bruce is 23 to 25 generations back from me, depending on which line I trace, but my Y-DNA would only be good for my Johnson line. There is also mitochondrial DNA (which can be tested at FamilyTreeDNA.com) which traces a mother's mother's mother's ... mother's line, passed from mother to children, and I think it goes back 52 generations. So, that can be helpful. And there is X-DNA, which is a bit more complicated. It follows X-chromosomes passed to the child. For males, it goes back to the mother's X-chromosome, which goes to both her parents' X-chromosomes. For females, it goes back to both parents' X-chromosomes. So, it offers a subset of the whole tree, but it goes back greater than 10 generations. And with DNA, there is a site called MyTrueAncestry which matches DNA to ancient samples. For example, consider one of my research scenarios and how this all pulls together. Through mytrueancestry, my DNA matches Clan Robertson, which is the parent clan of Clan Skene. And I have verified DNA connections to Skeen via my 4x great grandmother and her parents and grandparents. DNA-wise, I had references to the beginning and my end of the Skeen/Skene line. It took books and documents to pull it all together and to find that connection back to Robert the Bruce.

What I knew/know, documents and pulling it together

I am descended from Clan Skene through my 4x great grandmother Nancy "Charity" (Skeen) Johnson. I had family documents and sources (here, here, here, here and here) that let me know about the Skeens in my family. I found my 4x great grandmother's ancestry and connections with a combination of sources (will, land grant, death certificate and books - see aforementioned parenthetical with links). I have also verified autosomal DNA connection to her and her parents and her grandparents. And the Skenes are my gateway to Robert the Bruce (which I discovered during that 2-year period of researching books, articles and sources about Clan Skene and Robert the Bruce). And then I followed the ton of documentation regarding Robert the Bruce from multiple sources to get further back to notable figures who also were documented well in regards to their ancestries and descendants. The further you go back, the more you have to rely on documentation and history than genetics.

And that's how I found Robert.